The Landsman Foundation responds to all the claims and conspiracies that appeared today on various websites and caused many parents not to vaccinate their children against the polio virus, thereby sabotaging efforts to stop the epidemic
18 / 8 / 2013 - The circular arguments of vaccine opponents. Uri Goren requested and received an answer to the questions from the representative of the World Health Organization
This record is a continuation of the previous record on the polio. For an explanation of the virus, the difference between the vaccines and the reason for choosing one vaccine over the other please read that post first: The things that infest the sewers.
(Editor's note, on 9/8/2013 it was decided in the Ministry of Health that The polio vaccine operation will expand to the whole country)
I like infectious diseases. really. This is why I went to study medicine - to fight infectious diseases. Bacteria, viruses, fungi, parasites and prions excite my imagination. How can something so small kill a person? Eliminate entire tribes in America and exterminate two-thirds of Europe? And most importantly - what can I do to stop them?
The answer is, of course, not much.
No matter what we invent, the creatures hidden from view are smarter than us. They develop resistance to antibiotics, create mutations resistant to antiviral drugs, and every few years, an entirely new species appears that slaughters us mercilessly. We can only give them cool initials (AIDS, SARI, JKD), and vigorously search for a better remedy.
In fact, the best thing to stop them is not to mess with them in the first place. That is - preventive medicine, or vaccinations in the case of infectious diseases.
As you all know, we have a polio outbreak in the south of the country. It started as samples from the sewers, continued with a vaccination campaign only for the residents of Rahat, spread to the entire south, and now the Ministry of Health has announced the next step - a live-attenuated vaccine for all children under the age of eight who live between Kiryat Gat and Mitzpe Ramon.
Why?
Because we were unable to control the outbreak with only a killed vaccine. The inactivated vaccine (IPV) is indicated for creating antibodies in the vaccinated person. 95% of children develop a high level of antibodies after one shot, and 99% develop a high level of antibodies upon completion of the vaccine series. The live attenuated vaccine, on the other hand, creates a very good level of antibodies in the intestine, but only after four doses. It is also a live vaccine, which means that theoretically it can mutate and become a very aggressive virus. Also, at a rate of one in a million or one in 2.5 million (depending on the type of vaccine) it may cause polio paralysis.
(We all remember that the polio virus itself causes paralysis in one in a thousand children, right?)
For decades it was customary to vaccinate in Israel with a combination of the killed vaccine and the weakened vaccine. One of the things that has been discovered over the years (not only in Israel, but also in the whole world) is that if you give the killed vaccine first and then the weakened vaccine, the side effect of paralysis is completely prevented. One of the advantages of the weakened vaccine is that it continues to be secreted from the digestive system for a certain period after the vaccine is given, and thus everyone who comes into contact with the baby's secretions (mostly the parents and sometimes the grandparents) is exposed to the vaccine and gets vaccinated himself. This is the most effective way to create a herd vaccine in case of polio.
But, administration of a weakened vaccine may still eventually result in a mutation, or the vaccine may reach a person whose immune system has failed and may contract polio.
In light of these data and the fact that there have been no polio cases in Israel since 1988, it was decided eight years ago to stop using the live attenuated vaccine. Why risk it if we don't have polio?
But you can't stop vaccinating completely. As we know, there is still wild polio in the world. The main exporters of polio are Pakistan, Afghanistan and Nigeria who for years refused to vaccinate their populations against polio. In the last year quite a lot of polio cases were also discovered in Somalia, apparently "importation" of the disease from another country (that is - a sick person arrived in Somalia, encountered a population with a low vaccination rate, and whoop - we have an outbreak). Since the world is a global village, polio cannot be trusted to obey political borders, so we had to continue to vaccinate, even though there have been no polio cases in Israel for years.
The result is that all children under the age of eight in Israel today only received the killed vaccine and not the weakened vaccine. This is excellent because it means that 99% of the children who were vaccinated did develop a high level of antibodies in the blood and are indeed vaccinated. The problem is that these antibodies are made in the blood. Polio is a virus that reaches the intestine. If the antibodies are in the blood - they will stop the polio when it enters the blood, but it will take time for the child to develop a sufficient level of antibodies in the intestine as well. These are completely different antibodies, the stimulus for their creation is different.
The result is a vaccinated child, who does not get polio, but can still excrete polio viruses from his digestive tract.
And this is exactly what we have - a very large group of well-vaccinated children who have not been infected with polio, but excrete the viruses into the sewage system.
Technically, it shouldn't bother those who don't usually drink our sewage. Practically, everyone who has a child knows that absolute sterility cannot be maintained. A child who doesn't wash his hands properly after eating, shoves his hands into the family salad plate, visits the mall and touches faucets, handles, chairs... you get the idea. These children can easily infect older people and children whose immune systems are problematic.
According to epidemiological tests, it became clear that the current excretors of the virus are children who were vaccinated only with the inactivated vaccine. In order to stop the secretion of polio from the intestines, all the children who were vaccinated with the killed vaccine in the southern district (not in the whole district - for now only from Kiryat Gat to Mitzpe Ramon) are going to be given the weakened vaccine. We already know that administering the killed vaccine before the weakened vaccine prevents the side effects of the weakened vaccine. Administering the weakened vaccine is supposed to stimulate the production of antibodies in the digestive system, thus stopping the secretion of the virus from the intestine.
Is this the same vaccine we once received?
Yes and no. There are three strains of polio that cause the disease. Their names are 1, 2, 3 (yes, I know, doctors are not a very original people). Strain 2 was eradicated years ago, so there is no need to vaccinate against it. The Ministry of Health insisted on not vaccinating with the weakened strain 2, even though the vaccine is still available, so as not to return to the population a strain that has already disappeared.
The vaccine that will be given to the people of the south is a live attenuated vaccine that contains only two of the three strains. Strain 2 was known as the worst of the three, and probably one of the main ones responsible for the post-vaccination paralysis cases, so getting it out would only do everyone good.
So it's the same polio vaccine, only minus one strain. More efficient, safer.
With a little luck (and yes, even in epidemiology you need luck sometimes) the outbreak will stop soon, and we can all go back to our decidedly unexciting lives.
**
At the request of readers from the blog's Facebook page, below are answers to the accumulated questions:
It turns out that there is something circulating on Facebook about "the ten things every parent should ask themselves" or something similar. This post makes several claims about the polio vaccine, and they are:
1. No safety trials have been conducted on the polio vaccine that is about to be given.
This, of course, is not true. The vaccine is the same vaccine that has been used since the fifties whose side effects are known. But of course you can't prescribe a vaccine without proving it's safe and that's what they did in the clinical trial who tested its effectiveness.
2. No large-scale clinical trials have been conducted on the vaccines that are about to be given.
Again, not true. here One experiment. here Another experiment (which specifically tests the administration of the weakened vaccine after the killed vaccine). here Third experiment,, and if anyone is interested in joining, here it isThe list of experiments that are currently underway About this vaccine.
3. The children of Israel will be the first to receive the live attenuated vaccine on such a scale.
See section 2.
4. The GSK company is a corrupt company with a dubious past, so you must not buy anything from it.
Perhaps, I do not know in depth everything related to all the different branches of this huge pharmaceutical company. What's more, very few companies in the world produce the weakened vaccine that contains only two strains. Would it be better if the Ministry of Health was Buy the vaccines from Snoopy-Aventis? Or maybe it's better to order Straight from India? Something tells me that regardless of which pharmaceutical company the vaccine would have come from - someone would have made the claim that "they cannot be trusted".
5. Ministry of Health recommendations contradictory the recommendations of the World Health Organization regarding the vaccine.
Uh… no. This vaccine is recommended to stop polio outbreaks in any country where polio is present. Also according to the branch of the World Health Organization that is responsible for the eradication of polio, and also according to the World Health Organization. What's more - the World Health Organization recommends ending the polio vaccination program by the age of five.
6. Dr. Michal Stein said at the Knesset committee meeting that it would be a mistake to vaccinate with the weakened vaccine.
Right. She did say that. She is an expert in pediatrics and infectious diseases, a highly respected doctor whose words are important. The only thing to remember about her quote is that the quote was said in June, almost two months ago. So we thought that we would be able to eliminate the outbreak by increasing the vaccination rate among children with the killed vaccine alone. Today we know other things. The decisions made should be adjusted according to current events.
7. Prof. Alon Mozes, an infectious disease expert at Hadassah said at the same meeting that the weakened vaccine is dangerous for populations with a poor immune system.
True, like Dr. Stein, Prof. Mozes is also an expert in infectious diseases and his words are also appreciated. But, like Dr. Stein's words, what Prof. Moses said was also said two months ago. What we know today is different from what we knew then. In addition - the weakened vaccine may be dangerous for populations with a problem with the immune system (therefore they and their family members are not vaccinated with the weakened vaccine), but the live virus can kill them.
8. How can it be that the weakened vaccine both protects the environment and threatens it?
Simple - the weakened immune system can immunize the environment, but if there is a person around who has a compromised immune system, the weakened immune system can harm him. That is why children who have a compromised immune system or close family members with a compromised immune system are not vaccinated (we are talking about cancer and serious diseases, yes? Not asthma...). People who do not come into contact with the aforementioned children's secretions - their chance of developing a disease as a result of the weakened vaccine is zero.
9. Why not vaccinate only the 5% of people who are not vaccinated against polio?
Because it won't help. This 5% consists of people who refused vaccines, people who are unable to get vaccinated for all kinds of reasons and people with a poor immune system who should not receive the vaccine. Also, our goal is to stop the virus circulating in the country, and the way to do this is by giving the weakened vaccine to those who excrete it.
10. Most adults were vaccinated with an expired vaccine, so everyone should be vaccinated and not just the children.
Maybe we'll get to that too. If we do not succeed in controlling the outbreak now, it is possible that the Ministry of Health will launch a vaccination operation for the entire population, as was the case in 1988. I really hope we don't get to that, because I don't want to live in a country where there is polio. It is too scary a disease that has killed too many people throughout history.
**
And at the request of the readers from the previous entry, below is a response to the video that is now circulating on the net:
1. The wild polio virus is harmless. The cause of the paralysis epidemic was DDT, lead and other poisons. In well-vaccinated populations there is an increase in the acute flaccid paralysis rate, regardless of polio.
Acute flaccid paralysis is a paralysis that appears suddenly and is characterized by limpness of the limbs. This is indeed the most famous sign of polio. But it can also be caused by Guillain-Barre syndrome, tumor diseases and other diseases. The World Health Organization requires monitoring of acute flaccid paralysis in order to identify polio cases as quickly as possible. Obviously, if there is massive monitoring of the paralysis, we will find more cases, even non-polio ones, right?
in Israel in the last ten years There was no increase in the number of acute flaccid paralysis cases, despite the well-vaccinated population. In India there is monitoring of acute flaccid paralysis for the same reason, and most of the cases in recent years indeed are not caused by polio (last page of the report).
But you can't trust the local data, so I went toWorld Health Organization website. Here you can select a country, a range of years (clicking on shift and the requested years), and see how many reports of acute flaccid paralysis there were. Not polio. The resulting table also provides the information about how many polio isolates there were.
When you check Israel, you find that there has been almost no change since 1995 in the number of acute flaccid paralysis cases, and that in about a third of the cases, a stool sample was taken that was negative for polio.
When you check India, which only two years ago was certified as the most polio-free country, you discover something amazing - there is an increase in the number of acute flaccid paralysis cases! About 80% of the cases each year have stool isolates, and what is amazing is that as the years progress, there are fewer and fewer polio isolates in the stool until zero. What is even more amazing is that as the years progress, polio is responsible for fewer cases of paralysis. As mentioned, there are many other things that can cause acute flaccid paralysis.
Is the polio virus really harmless?
Well, In the original experiment where the polio virus was discovered A sample from the spinal cord fluid of a boy who died of polio was injected into several laboratory animals and caused some of them to develop polio paralysis. So... this virus is very harmful when injected into animals. I don't know of any experiments where they will inject it into humans.
2. The definitions of polio changed and therefore there were fewer polio patients.
The definitions of polio became more narrow from the moment the virus could be isolated. There's no point in calling every person with acute flaccid paralysis polio if they don't have polio, right? This has an impact on the treatment (in case of misdiagnosis) and the prognosis of the person.
The definition of "isolation in feces of the polio virus in the case of acute flaccid paralysis is considered polio" has existed for many years, and yet there are fewer and fewer polio patients from 1988 (when the polio eradication program was announced) until today.
3. There are no polio patients in Israel even though there were isolates in feces in 2004 and 2006.
Right. The population of Israel is well vaccinated against polio and therefore we have had no cases of polio despite transient isolations. In 1988, however, as soon as the virus reached the population with a compromised immune system - we had cases of polio and death.
4. The protection from the vaccine is short-term and unreliable
She Long term And very much Reliable.
5. Vaccination cannot prevent the spread of the virus.
Correction - vaccination with the killed vaccine alone does not stop the spread of the virus (as we have seen). Getting vaccinated against the weakened virus will definitely stop it. It worked in Egypt a few months ago, I really hope it will work again.
71 תגובות
poetry
In the first two months, a baby carries antibodies from the mother. Therefore, vaccinations begin after two months.
But - for a qualified answer, turn to a drop of milk. There is no reason not to trust them.
In the current situation, is a newborn baby at risk of infection? I would appreciate it if you could answer soon.
point
Let's go through your ten lies:
1) The website of the Ministry of Health has a simple and accurate explanation of why the vaccine is given. Everything is visible and everything is known.
2) The information of the Ministry of Health and the World Health Organization is reliable and based on evidence. You think everything that comes from the establishment is bad. i think you are stupid Everyone is entitled to their opinion, right?
3) You are a poor liar. The World Health Organization is not affiliated with any drug manufacturer. You are also so stupid …. The drug manufacturers only lose from vaccines!!!!!!!! How cute can you be?
4) Unbelievable .... thanks to vaccination with a "live virus" (which there is no such thing but you won't understand ....) there is no more smallpox in the world. And there is no polio in most countries of the world.
5) In 2004, they stopped the OPV vaccine in Israel due to the incredible success of this vaccine. Since 1988, when they started this vaccine, not a single person (vaccinated) has fallen ill with this disease. Therefore, possible carriers of the disease are 9 years old and younger (I will explain the calculation to you elsewhere, I don't want to laugh at you too much here...) Therefore, 10 years old and older are not vaccinated.
Point - I am convinced that there is not a single person among the warehouses who did not vaccinate their young children first.
6) I don't understand - did you ask the Ministry of Health and they refused to answer you? Did you look at the bottle and the manufacturer's name was erased from there? And are you aware that there is only one source of the vaccine??
7) What is the connection? You claim that a parent will not endanger his children with a weakened vaccine... but does the same parent prevent his children from driving a car? Does he even belt them in the car??
8) Now you reveal what hurts you. You are a spoiled idiot who only thinks "I deserve it". Don't feel bad, there are many like you in Israel. Did you run for power yourself? Have you tried changing? Or are you just a spoiled little boy?
And besides, you do interest the government, after all, only when you are healthy can you pay taxes. When you are sick, or crippled by polio, you rise to power a lot. Stupid….
9) What is your point? If they store, say it's not good. If they don't store, say it's not good...
10) Who is vaccinated is a sucker and not dead? What's wrong with that?
Listen, you didn't say anything meaningful. You wrote a list of nonsense. Maybe take your hate somewhere else?
Beasts
You are just talking nonsense. How lucky that not everyone is as egotistical as you. What parent in his right mind would agree that his children serve in the army? You are just sick…….
Yotam - I am addressing you and not that idiot because you will understand.... One of the problems with the spread of the virus is that the virus will mutate and create a dangerous strain that is not susceptible to the vaccine. Then we are all in danger.
Hell, the main problem is not small groups of such and such ideologues. The problem is that a wild virus that circulates in the population will harm people with a weakened immune system due to illness, transplantation, etc., as well as those who were vaccinated with the killed virus but did not develop antibodies. Both of these groups may be from your immediate family or from the family of other vaccinees at some point in life. That is why it is important to stop the silent spread and then they will no longer have to live under this threat.
OK, so I'll try to summarize what I've understood so far (please correct me where I'm wrong):
Anyone who has been vaccinated in the past (with a weakened or dead virus) is protected against the disease and is not exposed to polio (may become a carrier in the worst case).
The very vaccination carries a risk of 1 in 1-2.5 million of having polio.
The purpose of the vaccine is completely altruistic - to provide protection to those who did not bother to get vaccinated until now, and do not bother to do so even today (and let's put aside the engines of vaccination for objective reasons for a moment).
The Ministry of Health's recommendation to run and get vaccinated actually means: "Please run to inject a potentially dangerous virus into your children, who are protected against the disease anyway, because there are people who have not been vaccinated and are not willing to be vaccinated even now, and must take care of them. Statistically, one of the children who get vaccinated will die, but hey, in the little one, it's all one child, at the most, get one more."
And now a problem:
What parent in his right mind would seriously consider risking the fruit of his womb, without it improving the protection for him and his family at all, just to protect a population that doesn't bother to protect itself by choice?! Is it just me that sounds weird?
You nicely attacked a lot of straw men who are irrelevant to most parents who are debating whether to vaccinate.
The difficult questions that they asked the Ministry of Health and even petitioned Begetz relate to the source of the medicine and the identity of the manufacturing company to the documents concerning the quality tests and the risk of infection, simple things that the Ministry of Health suspiciously hides.
It should be noted that the last case of the outbreak in the 89s was probably caused by poor and experimental vaccinations and not by direct infection. This is according to the State Comptroller's report from XNUMX. In light of this, one must be especially careful in the absence of certain information about the quality of the vaccine.
Hila
The time during which the weakened polio viruses are excreted from the vaccinated body is much longer than two weeks. There is no exact information on when the weakened polio stops being secreted, it varies individually.
Thanks, Michael, indeed there is no need. I just understand that two weeks after the vaccination, the children should be asked not to wash their hands after using the toilet, otherwise we did nothing.
Hila:
The bacteria do come from the digestive system, but the main means of infection - unpleasant to say - is the hands.
I imagine you don't have to be too graphic about it.
What is not completely clear to me is how the secretion of the antibodies from the digestive system of 7-year-old children immunizes the whole family? The children at this age are completely independent in their bathroom habits and we do not come into direct contact with their secretions.
10 things every parent must know:
1. When they try to push something on you, they take advantage of the fact that you want to be good parents. That's why they start with the sentence "that every parent must know" and this is a sign that they are working on you. Because naturally there is no such thing as someone deciding what to know and what not to know.
2. The "to know" in the aforementioned sentence does not refer to any knowledge. Because the fact that someone comes and tells you stories about vaccines and diseases does not make it news. It's just like an astrologer will come and say something... it's not news. It's a story.
3. The World Health Organization serves the pharmaceutical companies. And as such his goal is to earn. Look at all the money that Bibi has spent on the unnecessary vaccinations until now.
4. I wouldn't think of injecting a live virus just because someone said it was healthy.
5. Ask those who are trying to inject you with the live virus to take pictures of themselves and their families injecting themselves with a live virus.
6. Note that almost nothing is revealed to you. Not even the source of the vaccine. Some say GSK, some say a company from India. In short, the Ministry of Health is hiding important information.
7. Note that every day more than 100 people are injured in road accidents. And no one was harmed by the polio.
8. General tip Don't trust the government, you don't care about it that much.
9. Check what is happening with the vaccinations in Ramat Aviv and Kfar Shmariahu.
10. Friars don't die.
*yours= theirs
Asaf
The opposite side - he is also heard. As you read in this article and even in other articles where evolution is opposed, for example.
Also reading the opposite side I hope you will (as you imply) vaccinate your children, as I do not want my healthy children to contract your diseases.
Regarding sections 6 and 7, it is true that time has passed, but who said they changed their minds? I am in favor of giving vaccines, but if you want to present data for and against that will also bring the side of against.
Asaf:
Just so that you don't think that the problem is with you, I will point out that the offer to get vaccinated now is not intended for the same purpose as the dead vaccine that they received was intended for and any reasonable person knows this and therefore no reasonable person will conclude that he was lied to.
I am not responsible for those who are not of sound mind.
The problem with you Assaf is that you don't know who most of the current vaccine refusers are and why they refuse.
For your information: most of the current vaccine refusers refuse because they have already received a polio vaccine, they say to themselves, for example, "If we have to get vaccinated again, it's a sign that we were lied to about the vaccine we already received." This is not the only problem that makes people distrust the health care system.
The problem is with "vaccine refusers", first they don't get vaccinated at all
And so they fear (rightly) receiving the vaccine with a weakened virus,
Thus they constitute a population at risk but also a population of power carriers.
That means a double risk for themselves and their environment,
*Correction* to my last message regarding Maximilian's links.
The fourth link given by Maximilian is wrong and should be
icmr.nicDOTin/ijmr/2009/November/editorial1.pdf
In all 4 links he gave, the letters DOT should be replaced with the single character ".", that is, the dot character, and then we will get a legitimate web address.
The fourth link given by Maximilian is wrong and should be
icmr.nicDOTn/ijmr/2009/November/editorial1.pdf
In all 4 links he gave, the letters DOT should be replaced with the single character "." Then we will get a legitimate web address.
The owner of the nickname "the troll skeptic"
You are really a troll, that's why you chose to hide behind an anonymous nick instead of displaying the real nick you usually use.
Your comment is nonsense. As the trolls do.
The medical literature talks about a risk of 1 in 750,000 for one dose. Not a million and not 2.4 million
1 to 750,000
rstb.royalsocietypublishingDOTorg/content/368/1623/20120140.full.pdf+html
1 to 750,000
sciencedirectDOTcom/science/article/pii/S0042682205005830
1 to 790,000
eurosurveillanceDOTorg/ViewArticle.aspx?ArticleId=2529
1 to 143,000
icmr.nicDOTn/ijmr/2009/November/editorial1.pdf
Ofer
Today I saw your long message accompanied by documents. I will read it in full or in part and will reply to you in due course with my response. I don't have extra time, so I may not respond at all or only respond to things that are important to me. In particular I will check the information you claim about *one in a million* safety. I don't guarantee that I will actually read because I don't want to, for example, read several documents of dozens of pages with the relevant information hidden somewhere inside them. I will not sit for a very long time on this kind of reading. If I find that there is reliable and easy-to-read evidentiary information about the claim *one in a million*, I will not be ashamed to admit that my claim *plucked from the finger* is a false claim. Unlike you, the demagogue, I don't make snarky comments to hide the fact that I was wrong in something or failed in something.
Skeptic, of course this is just your opinion (and it does not match the findings in reality)
The funniest thing was when you tried to prove your claims while making sentences like: "Based on my understanding, I concluded that the Landsman Foundation is deliberately misleading regarding the 3 links she brought"
- Yes, Skeptic, thank you very much for drawing our attention to the fact that the Landsman Foundation is deliberately misleading. Where would we be if not for you?
Ofer
Today I saw your long message accompanied by documents. I will read it in full or in part and will reply to you in due course with my response. I don't have extra time, so I may not respond at all or only respond to things that are important to me. In particular I will check the information you claim about one in a million safety. I don't guarantee that I will actually read because I don't have in my mind, for example, to read a number of documents of tens of pages with the relevant information hidden somewhere inside them, I will not sit for weeks on this kind of reading. If I find that there is reliable and easy-to-read evidentiary information about the claim one in a million, I will not be ashamed to admit that my claim *sucked from the finger* is a false claim. Unlike you, the demagogue, I do not spread irrelevant comments to hide the fact that I was wrong in something or failed in something.
Ofer
This is a response I promised you on August 12 that I would write. As far as I'm concerned, I have nothing more to add.
About three days ago I wanted to respond to your words that were criticism of me. This comment is recorded on my computer. I refrained from publishing my response because I thought that the harsh things I said towards you were too harsh. Now it is clear to me that their harshness was justified, but there is no longer any point in publishing them because most of the things will be written here. In my opinion, you are a demagogue and superficial and attribute your shortcomings to me. If I don't respond right away it's because it's a lot of trouble, I don't usually just throw out words as an answer, it's a practice of demagogues like you. And now to the point.
beginning. The Landsman Foundation gave three links as evidence that the component given in Israel in the vaccine has been thoroughly tested in clinical trials. The rest of her links apart from these three are not particularly interesting to me. Her second link is, as mentioned, misleading. She brings as a clinical trial an experiment that has not yet taken place. The reference to her two other links is written below.
Three days ago (at the time of my first response to the words of the Landesman Foundation) I came to the conclusion that at least one of the two remaining links (besides the second link I mentioned earlier) is very misleading, it is her first link about clinical trials in India. I read the third link (about clinical trials in Pakistan and Afghanistan) and I wasn't sure if I understood it correctly, although it also seemed to me to be misleading at the time. Based on this understanding, I concluded that the Landsman Foundation is deliberately misleading regarding the 3 links it provided. As mentioned, I did not have time to detail this argument three days ago, but it was important that I immediately state my opinion on Landsman (the detail could have been postponed).
Here are the details regarding her other two links. If you don't understand my arguments I'm sorry, I tried to be detailed and I don't have time to elaborate more.
Regarding her first link, I currently only say this:
The experiment in India is giving oral vaccines of different types without injectable vaccines that preceded them. Oral vaccines have been well known for decades, vaccines have *many complications* because of which they were taken out of use worldwide in 2005, especially they have the complication of the type called derivative paralysis. The derived paralysis is a paralysis caused by the weakened virus. Apparently, these complications also occurred in the experiments in India, but there is no reference to them in the first link. The first link, the Indian one, does not deal with the complications of vaccinations at all. The purpose of the Indian experiment is only: to test in a comparative test the successes of the different types of vaccines (successes in preventing ordinary polio disease and preventing ordinary polio carriers). Therefore: the vaccines in India from the first link do not prove that the oral vaccine in Israel today is free of complications at the level of one complication per million (a level of one per million thanks to the injection vaccine that preceded the oral vaccine). The matter of the aforementioned complications is the main thing on which there is a dispute, it was the clinical trial they asked her to do. Since the Landsman Foundation presented the Indian experiment as an experiment that excludes the risk of complications (one in a million), it worked on us.
Regarding the third link, the vaccination in Pakistan and Afghanistan, currently only says this:
These are again oral vaccines that were not preceded by injection vaccines, even in which there was only a comparative test of the success of preventing polio with different types of oral vaccine. They also had the usual complications of oral vaccines. This vaccine also does not prove that the oral vaccine in Israel is without risk (one in a million) if it was preceded by an injection. Again the Landsman Foundation worked for us in the poor. I have more to say about the vaccine, an amazing thing if it is true, but I won't say it right now because it doesn't concern the unreliability of the Landsman Foundation. If I find time I will write in a separate response the additional matter mentioned above.
I will now add more things regarding the unreliability of the words of the Landsman Foundation, when it claims that the oral vaccine in Israel is a safe vaccine based on extensive clinical trials. I draw your attention to the things that were said in a blog article by "Ishton" a few days ago and in his response to one of the commenters a day or two later. I don't have a link, search Ishton's blog on Google. "Ishton" refers to 3 more links from the Landsman Foundation (which supposedly confirm the safety of the vaccine in Israel based on extensive clinical trials), about 3 more links where he claims that the foundation's claim about them is misleading because they are not relevant to its claim about safety due to the introduction of an injection vaccine. (He says this about 5 links, two of which are the first and third links I mentioned above).
In conclusion. My impression regarding the above deceptions is a very well-founded impression: The Landsman Foundation does not present reliable clinical studies regarding the immunization procedure in Israel (the one that includes preliminary vaccinations by injection), especially it does not show (according to these studies) that the complication rate is one in a million. The 6 links she gives in this matter are all misleading.
Below, in the following, I referred to the last paragraph in your words.
I claimed that the current immunization procedure in Israel has not been tried in any country in Western Europe. In response you said something that is interpreted as if the Landsman Foundation pointed to such a country in the West. Your nonsense: she did not point to any such country. Also, I have not come across anywhere else (outside of her article) about any oral vaccine being widespread in Western countries. Israel is probably the only country in the West that has recently received the oral vaccine.
Regarding my claim that no country's polio carrier numbers are published. You want me to back up this claim. Are you kidding me ? How can I get you backup for this kind of claim? I looked for it and did not find it. How do you expect me to show you a reference for material that I don't think exists. I invited you to bring such information if you have it, I did it to show you that such information does not exist. Israel is the only country in the world that published such information as a justification for the oral polio vaccine.
As for my claim that the number is one in a million (vaccine victims), I sound like a sucker. I claimed this because I found no evidence for this claim. Your appeal to me to provide backup for this claim of mine is another smear attempt of yours. If you cannot provide a reference for the "one in a million" claim, simply say that you do not have such information and that you are not willing to look for such information.
Miracles
People like B and a skeptic have no "stupid respect". They have no respect at all. At most they only have the "idiot".
Maybe that's why they are full of hate.. I don't know
It is not clear to me how anyone dares to risk the lives of their children because of... Because of stupidity? Because they read an article by a moron?
There is a higher probability of being electrocuted from the keyboard than contracting polio due to a vaccine.
How bad can you be? Your stupid "honor" is better than your child's health?
Bunch of mentally ill people…….
It is also not clear why the consultant links the size of a particular company with its reliability.
If anything then the opposite:
The bigger a company is, the more powerful and influential it is, and there is a fear that it will use its power in an unwanted way.
Dear Mr. B,
Look at two comments above you - there is a full breakdown of the "less than one in a million" claim. Want to know who did the research? Go to the link. On the other hand, a skeptic winked at the claim "the number one million is sucked from the finger" without any supporting explanation. If he wanted to know where the source of the number came from, he would have probably written: "Ken, what is the source of the number" or maybe he would have searched on the net (it took me 5 minutes).
But that's not what he did - he firmly stated that "the number one million is sucked from the finger" and after that he further testified to himself that he was only commenting on facts that he had checked carefully. In one word - nonsense. What really happened is that he did a classic successful method here - made a scandalous claim and if no one answers, then people think it is true.
Lasnath,
You are trying the same trick of the skeptic, which blew up in his face. At least it was original.
Take one link about an experiment that has not yet finished. In the same sentence there are links to trials that have been completed and that prove that the oral vaccine is reliable and safe. The fact that you write two exclamation marks! In every sentence! Just shows how weak your argument is.
It seems to me that the consultant is a troll.
He obliges the skeptic to bring proof that he does not have a sister. While he himself does not provide evidence for his statements.
A claim like "one in a million" must be fully backed up. Conclusive evidence must be provided for such a claim. It is necessary to specify what the research was done and by whom this research was done.
I read the articles to which the author referred.
Unfortunately, I read according to what is written: in the articles it is written that the clinical trials will only end in 2014. Now they are only recruiting children for the trials.
In the experiments we first gave 2 doses of oral vaccine in drops and only then ipv! It's really not the same experiment and it still doesn't have results that indicate anything!
The conclusion - Keren, you proved that we are participating in a large-scale experiment to determine the effectiveness of giving a killed vaccine and only after that a weakened one in healthy children!
Keren, you also proved in your quotes that there is no immune memory from ipv, and from the oral vaccine as of 1975, the memory is about 3 years.
Next time it is better not to write down things that you hope readers with a little reading comprehension will understand that they have nothing to do with writing!
skeptic,
Before you jump in with the logic thing: that I am asking for a source for the claim "the number one in a million is finger-sucked" I mean that you bring some qualified source with a number that is fundamentally bad. Or at least a qualified source that says "no studies have been conducted regarding OPV damage". As long as you don't find such a source, then you can say that the number "less than 1 in a million" has qualified sources (see my last response) - while your claim "the number XNUMX in a million is sucked from the finger" is a claim without any basis and you yourself eh.. (hold on yourself Ofer), you winked at her from somewhere.
skeptic,
Do you want to get to hear a source for number one in a million? you are welcome:
1. Ministry of Health. In the section "Effects and side effects after receiving the vaccine" here: http://www.health.gov.il/Subjects/vaccines/two_drops/Pages/Vaccination.aspx
"There may be an extremely rare complication (less than 1 case per million vaccine doses) - the appearance of a paralytic disease." He also says and I quote: "In Israel, there was no case of VAPP during all the years of providing the combined trivalent OPV + Enhanced IPVT program. This combination was included in the routine vaccination program in 1990-2004."
Do you want a scientific source? Please: http://www.who.int/bulletin/archives/80(3)210.pdf
England: 1 to 1.4 million (between the years 85 and 90)
USA: 1 to 2.5 million (between the years 80 and 89)
India: 1 to 4.1 million (in 99)
I remind you: you claimed that the number one in a million was sucked from the finger, and you did not provide any source for this.
You claimed: "Israel is the only country that.. blah blah blah" - and you still haven't provided a source.
Now you add and throw more and more claims but you still haven't brought a single proof of your first things. I suggest you start with that.
By the way, your new claims - not only have you not provided evidence for them either, but they are also referenced in the original article:
A. "It is very difficult from the few studies that have been carried out to find out if the current vaccination campaign will significantly reduce the number of polio carriers"
There is even a specific study regarding the "effectiveness of mass vaccination campaigns in OPV" - in section 4 at the end - http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22766207. The vaccine itself has been given since the 50s, and there are studies on its effectiveness (see section 1)
B. "I do not buy the claim that many will not be harmed by the vaccine, because the matter will not be seriously examined."
Here you are already blatantly lying - even in your first comment you opened section 2 and read the links there, to look for mistakes. See section 1 and 2 of Keren.
third. "I also do not trust the manufacturers of the vaccine, the gsk pharmacology company, they are big frauds"
Refer to it in section 4
d. "Children have a weak immune system, if there are complications with the vaccine and there are victims, they will tell us that it has nothing to do with the vaccine."
And if there are polio victims, you will tell us that there is no connection to polio. - As a matter of fact, sections 7 and 8 of the Foundation.
Counselor de la Shemte (and Troll).
I didn't say anything about the vaccines.
(As you noticed - but you don't admit it)
But it doesn't matter, because you don't talk to trolls - you just answer...
The main thing is that other readers will understand that you do not understand what you are talking about. (although most have already figured it out)
advises de la Shemata
Since you claim to know my comments and on the other hand you use a new and unfamiliar nickname, I am not interested in arguing with you. Does not talk to trolls, including trolls who exchange nicknames.
Talking about topics that are unfamiliar to you may be typical of you, don't refer your faults to others. I explained my words well.
You presented yourself as an advisor on matters you do not know, vaccines. In short, you are a consultant de la shamte. I will finish at this point, because as mentioned I have no interest in arguing with a troll.
"I also don't trust the manufacturers of the vaccine, the gsk pharmacology company. These are big frauds caught in the United States and China."
It's good to hear that you don't trust the fourth largest pharmaceutical company in the world with a turnover of tens of billions of dollars...
There are also people who think that quantum mechanics is nonsense... but trust their GPS...
It's just a shame that you don't bother to point out the fact that you have no knowledge of the subject you're talking about, nor do you have any authority to advise others on these subjects.
How do you expect them to believe you?
shame.
"Regarding the state of polio morbidity. My opinion in general is that all the reactions of the health system are reckless," - you are simply funny.
So your opinion in general is like this.. So that's your opinion... No one asked about your opinion, if you haven't noticed. What they wanted to find out were facts. And not your "opinion" (which has nothing to do with the facts).
Counselor de la Shemme
Ofer.
You didn't hurt me, I just can't stand fussy people and you are fussy at least in the field of the polio vaccine as well as in the field of logic.
Basic logic. When I claim that the number one in a million is a finger-suck, while in your opinion it is a faithful number to reality, the burden of proof is on you. (I searched and searched and did not find any verified information on the percentage of morbidity among those vaccinated with the Israeli system, I have no possibility *to prove that I found zero information*, if you do not understand that I do not have such a possibility, then you have a problem with understanding logic).
I am not interested in definitions of demagoguery and the like in a dictionary or Wikipedia. The essence of demagoguery is clear.
Regarding the state of polio morbidity. My opinion in general is that all the reactions of the health system are reckless, there is no panic in the vaccine, you need to check what is really effective and what is harmful. Also, we are not a banana republic and we don't have to vaccinate just because someone puts pressure on us. Here is a repetition of the swine flu vaccine nonsense.
.
There was a polio outbreak in Israel in 1988 with individual patients and they did not make any festival about it, they gave an increased oral vaccine for several years and the disease stopped immediately without any additional patients. I do not buy the claim that many will not be harmed by the vaccine, because the matter will not be seriously examined. Children have a weak immune system, if there are complications with the vaccine and there are victims, they will tell us that it has nothing to do with the vaccine.
It is very difficult from the few studies that have been carried out to find out if the current vaccination campaign will significantly reduce the number of polio carriers. There are claims by researchers that the number of polio carriers will hardly decrease, so why make an unnecessary commotion.
I also don't trust the manufacturers of the vaccine, the gsk pharmacology company, they are big crooks caught in the United States and China. In the United States they paid the largest fines in history, 3 billion dollars for fraud, in China they were kicked out of operations in China because they bribed the health system there left and right.
Ofer
I don't understand this issue, so I don't intend to get into the discussion too much, I'll just point out that according to the previous responses of a "skeptic" on all kinds of issues - his credibility when it comes to the truth of what he says is in great doubt. is very. For your attention and the attention of other readers. (so that you don't waste your time on a futile argument with him)
In the last response it should have been written "The number one in a million is sucked from the finger"
But no outbreak! nothing!!!! Not a single clinical case came to the hospital! Not even one! There is a visit from the World Health Organization, there is a visit from the American Center for Disease Control, both cases at the end of June. There is a "virus that comes from Egypt" and whoop! Store an entire country? on feces???? We will need a stronger argument than this for an unclear outbreak.
skeptic,
I'm sorry if I offended you, but you are so full of self-importance (even in your last comment) - I just couldn't help myself..
As a matter of fact. I repeat what I said in the first comment. You said something - you will bring a reference! The number half a million sucked from the finger? Bring a reference. Israel is the only country that blah blah blah? Bring evidence. Don't task barbarians to do your job, and don't say that if they can't (do your job!) it's because you're right.
And just one last thing, from Wikipedia: "Demagogy is a method of persuasion and obtaining political power based on appealing to prejudices, fears, superstitions and the expectations of the general public - often through the use of inflammatory and emotional rhetoric and propaganda, and often through the use of national or populist motifs, and selective mention of facts .”
anonymous.
Consult a doctor.
Ofer
I will write a long answer maybe tomorrow and maybe more answers. At this point, I'll just say that you tend to engrave.
My response tomorrow, if I find time, will refer only to your first response today, August 12th, it is a long response and I do not intend to prolong the debate with a demagogue like you, therefore I doubt if I will refer to your second response today.
I will state in general that, unlike you, I try to be precise. When I say "I'm sure" I mean that I'm sure, when I say "I guess" I mean that I guess (only), when I say "I bet" I mean that I would bet (if I could bet money), and so further. Spreading words in other directions, as you do for the purpose of demagoguery, is not acceptable to me.
I bet that the percentage of polio carriers in the states of immigration in the United States, such as for example California, is very high (at least as it is today in Israel). This is because of the movement between this area and South America and because of the clinical research initiated in South America, no studies are done on an area without polio carriers.
If you still can't get the number of polio carriers - it's because it's hidden (or unimportant regarding the need for oral vaccination). Here's a real challenge for you instead of a joke, bring the number of carriers in the United States. It seems to me that you won't be up to the challenge, it's easier for you to be rude.
I must say that there is something in this whole story that I do not understand and I would be happy if someone who knows (not a "skeptic" God forbid) would explain it.
At the time I read that the difference between the vaccine with the killed virus and the vaccine with the weakened virus (besides the level of risk) is in the fact that the vaccine with the weakened virus creates a "herd vaccine" but not in the sense that it is talked about today:
According to what I read then, the advantage of the weakened virus vaccine is that it is contagious, so when one child is vaccinated - many of those around him are also indirectly vaccinated.
It sounds logical, but it does not match the explanations given today and also raises a question about a certain finding.
The explanation I keep hearing on the radio recently is that among those vaccinated with the dead virus (which is all the children born since the use of the weakened virus was stopped) may be carriers.
If I'm not mistaken, this is probably true, but with a serious limitation - if a person is vaccinated with the killed virus - his body kills the virus when it tries to enter its cells, therefore when someone "carries" he can only "carry" the virus in his digestive system.
Furthermore: even those who are vaccinated with the weakened virus can be a carrier of this type.
In other words - the "carriage" does not differentiate between those vaccinated with a killed virus and those vaccinated with a weakened virus.
Now - this could have been an alternative and logical explanation for the need to go back and vaccinate with the weakened virus, but it also raises a question about the finding that started the initiative.
As you remember - the motive for all the activity is the fact that viruses of the wild strain were found in the sewer system and the question is what caused that there are now more such viruses in the sewer system and how a vaccine with the weakened virus will change the situation in the sewers.
The answers I can think of are the following:
1. The wild strain multiplied in the sewer for reasons unrelated to the vaccine and the vaccine with the weakened virus will not change the findings in the sewer but will only strengthen the population and reduce the chances of contracting the virus.
2. The wild strain could breed in the sewer only because it managed to push the legs of the weakened strain away because the wild strain is more resistant and during the period when the people vaccinated the weakened strain it was only able to push the legs of the wild strain out of the sewer thanks to the ongoing reinforcement it received from the secretions of those vaccinated in it.
I would love to read the opinion of someone who knows the subject in depth.
Is it necessary to vaccinate a 6-year-old child who has epilepsy?
Is it necessary to vaccinate a 6-year-old child who has epilepsy and takes Deflapt twice a day?
And one more thing, skeptic - regarding "I only comment on facts that I check carefully," which is an exact quote from you.
"The number one in a million is sucked from the finger" claim. Did you check it "carefully"? really? I'm sure you can link to a study that shows a different number.
And you claimed this: "And don't try to sell me a story as if there are no carriers of ordinary polio in other Western countries, look for information about carriers there and you won't find it because no one publishes it and doesn't make an issue of it" (by the way, this sounds like a classic conspiracy - there is something but no one publishes it). I'm sure you've also checked this carefully, and you can tell a study that also shows that there are carriers, and another source that shows that they know there are but don't publish it.
And as for "I bet the United States is flooded" - really that's already too much, you finished me. I find it hard to believe that a person like you, who only reacts to facts that he checks carefully, would bet at all, and in particular on matters of fate like this.
Please, stop betting on our health. Thanks.
skeptic,
you dodge There is a sentence with 4 links, in which one of them appears in the middle and should have appeared as part of the last link. You chose to call this "she presents an experiment that was not conducted at all as proof that the vaccine was well tested" even though two other links do refer to experiments that were conducted. To say that you didn't mention the other links because "I don't respond to what I haven't checked" is nonsense, I'm sure you opened every link to find something wrong that would support your position.
You claim that Israel is "the only Western country that.." - nice of you. Keren makes claims, and they are backed up in articles. You make claims and they are backed up by "search for information and you won't find it" or "the number one in a million is sucked from your finger".
Sorry, that's not convincing.
The scientific arguments are important and justified. But unfortunately it is not possible to convince the convinced. There is a parasitic population in Israel who, under the guise of enlightenment and pseudo-individualism, choose not to vaccinate their children while they trust in the herd vaccination effect and wrap it up in ideologies and scientific "facts". Unfortunately, herd immunity really protects them and they can continue to smell healthy" by not "pushing toxins into their bodies" while my vaccinated children are protecting them
*Amendment - "meaning according to section 1"
This whole business smells very bad to me, especially in light of the reasons given for stopping the weakened vaccine in 2005.
Before that we gave the killed vaccine + the weakened vaccine to the children of Israel.
The reasons why they decided to change the polio vaccine protocol were detailed in an Israeli scientific article from 2006
The most important reasons for omitting OPV from the vaccination program are discussed below:
• Recent studies in Israel demonstrated that contrary to former belief, OPV when administered together with IPV,
may not confer significant "gut immunity" against infection by polio virus (T. Swartz, personal communication, 2004).
According to the results of recent studies, the addition of OPV to IPV does not confer a significant benefit over the
IPV only program, but it does have definitive risks (see below).
• In the last 3–5 years, outbreaks of circulating vaccineb associated paralytic polio have been reported in Haiti, the
Dominican Republic and Madagascar, and have since been recognized as responsible for outbreaks that occurred in
Egypt in the 1960s [5].
• Revertant OPV type 2 with mutations developing over time and differing from the vaccine strain by 9-14.2% have been
repeatedly isolated from the sewage of the Tel Aviv area since 1998. These revertant vaccine derived viruses have
been shown to be invasive and neurovirulent in mice [6, and L. Shulman, personal communication, 2004].
• The WHO has decided to implement simultaneous global cessation of OPV vaccination soon after global polio eradication
cation in order to prevent vaccine-associated outbreaks [7]. OPV is not safe in a world where vaccination coverage is
not high and where the number of immunocompromised patients continues to increase as a result of cancer treatment, organ transplantations
and AIDS.
When weighing the unproven benefits of adding OPV to the IPV program with the definitive and proven risk of OPV, the Israel
The Ministry of Health has decided to discontinue the administration of OPV.
http://www.ima.org.il/FilesUpload/IMAJ/0/48/24101.pdf
That is, according to section 2, the weakened vaccine neither gives nor adds to the new killed vaccine.
And according to section 3 and more, how is there a risk of paralysis from the vaccine even for those vaccinated with the weakened vaccine, contrary to the position of the article here and the Ministry of Health who claim that there is zero risk.
This is exactly why they stopped with the weakened vaccine in Israel.
So what's the story here?
Ofer
Stop rambling on about half-truths and conspiracies. I only comment on facts that I check carefully, I don't comment on what I haven't checked. Also another link from a misleading foundation, but I didn't have time to check enough about what it misled, so I only mentioned it in a hint.
Regarding the conspiracy claim. Israel is the only country in the West that makes a weakened vaccine without having even one case of active paralysis. And don't try to sell me a story as if there are no carriers of ordinary polio in other western countries, look for information about carriers there and you won't find it because no one publishes it or makes an issue of it. I bet that the United States is flooded with carriers from South American countries because there is still active polio there, the link experiment number 2 is designed to address exactly this problem.
date
I forgot to mention. Those who are vaccinated are not vaccinated again for themselves but for others.
The killed vaccine protects against infection of the blood system only and does not protect against infection of the intestines. Vaccinated and killed virus can be carriers because virus in the gut is not killed by this vaccine. The purpose of the weakened vaccine is to produce an inflammation in the intestines against the weakened virus and by this inflammation they want to eliminate the normal polio virus in the intestines if there is one. The word "inflammation" in popular language is a word that expresses vigorous activity of the immune system to destroy an infection.
date
Yigal gives misleading information.
Those who are not vaccinated and are infected with a weakened virus may get sick with a weaker version of polio. This fact was proven in India where parts of it were vaccinated with weakened viruses without first receiving a vaccine of killed viruses. The number one in a million is sucked from the finger. Israel is the only country in the western world where a vaccine with a weakened virus is given only to those vaccinated with a killed virus, in this respect Israel is the guinea pig of the western world.
Merav, the idea is that those who are already immunized in death will receive the weakened one, in order to passively immunize all those who are not immunized at all. And in general, what Shigael said (see above).
The weakened vaccine does not transfer to people who have not been vaccinated in the dead. He stores them.
Hi Karen, thanks for the info!
If there is a pregnant woman and she has a small child of the vaccine age, is it recommended to vaccinate them and expose the pregnant woman to the possibility that after a weakened vaccine there will be a possibility of infection? (if at all such an option exists)
Karen well done!!!
Is it possible to get an answer to the following questions? The recommendation is not to get weakened without being killed right? But on the other hand, you say that the goal of the disadvantaged is to move to the population, among other things. Is the Ministry of Health building on the fact that the weakened will move to those who have already been vaccinated? What will happen if the weakened passes to people who have not been vaccinated?
Well, that's exactly what everyone says. 95% of the population is vaccinated, some can spread the disease and not contract it and now all 95% have to be vaccinated again and risk everything that involves introducing a live virus into the body, just to keep the 5% who are not vaccinated against polio or any other disease. True, the risk is low, (1 in a million to 100K, depending on which representative statistics you choose to believe). Anyone who wants to expose their child to the dangers of the live virus is welcome to do so. By the way, the percentage of those with "weak immune deficiency" is extremely low, within the 5% in question. In the absolute majority of cases, these are people who have made a conscious decision not to take care to vaccinate themselves... Their right to act selfishly must be respected and we can only hope that this case will teach them to align themselves, since this group endangers us with every outbreak of both new and old disease.
stop lying
We are not talking about "Israeli children" but children from the south.
In short, Bibi's friends want experience and Bibi donated the children of the south to them.
Ofer, thank you for your comment, people who are not knowledgeable in the field need guidance that will help them decide what is right and what is wrong.
skeptic,
You are right about the second link, it should have appeared in the "list of experiments taking place now" - a link that appears later in the sentence. But you chose not to mention the fact that the first and third links do refer to experiments that have already been carried out. To me, this is a half-truth that is worse than a lie.
To say that this is a deception that reinforces the fear of negligence is about as reliable as the conspiracy theories about Rabin's murder that say there is a discrepancy of 10 minutes between the time of arrival recorded at Ichlov and the time of the shooting, and from this it is clear that Rabin was murdered by Peres.
What we have here is:
1. An article by Keren that includes facts backed up by links and articles.
2. Danny's misleading response, which includes blatant deception, and relies on the readers not opening the links.
3. Your response, which includes a half-truth, relies on the fact that the readers do not open the links and then scatters blatant hints without any evidence: "I have other serious reservations... but right now I don't have time to present them".
My impression is that your and Danny's comments are the ones that use the citizens of Israel as test subjects to test the theory "you don't need to get vaccinated".
Ofer
As far as I understand, link number 2 is a link about an experiment that never took place! This is an experiment of several years, 5 years as I imagine, which is planned to be conducted in Latin America.
If anyone was concerned that the whole issue of oral vaccination against a virus in Israel is being carelessly handled, then the deception of the author of the article Karen Landesman only strengthens the fear. After all, she presents an experiment that was not conducted at all as proof that the vaccine was thoroughly tested.
I have other serious reservations about some of Landsman's claims that I have read, but I don't have time to present them at the moment because I haven't tested them sufficiently.
In general: my impression that the Western countries have decided to use the citizens of Israel as test subjects before they decide if the new procedure of the two-component oral vaccine against polio bOPV is a vaccine that will be good for the rest of the West. The citizens of Israel are not supposed to be anyone's guinea pigs.
Danny, you are wrong.
See links in section 2, and compare to the vaccine given by the Ministry of Health:
http://www.health.gov.il/Subjects/vaccines/two_drops/Pages/Vaccination.aspx
If you have more specific information about the Ministry of Health's vaccine, you are welcome to attach it here, and show why it is not related to the links provided in section 2.
It is appropriate that the Dr. carefully check the sources that she puts here.
All the links to the experiments she brought with results do not refer at all to the specific vaccine given by the Ministry of Health.